« zpět na výpis měsíce |

[Talk-cz] Názor a návrhy; Was: Critical Mass for license change-over

Vlákno 31.3. - 2.4.2012, počet zpráv: 2

31.3.2012 05:03:28 (#1)

Pavel Machek

<pavel at ucw.cz>
1066 1226
Ahoj! zobrazit citaci
> Zdravím Pavla a ostatní přispěvatele z Čech,
(Sorry ze mi to tak dlouho trvalo). zobrazit citaci
> Nyní můj názor na minimalizaci škod a případného uzamknutí dat > v organizaci, se kterou minimálně někteří nesouhlasí. > > 1) požadovat úpravu CT tak, aby byla zajištěna kontrola komunitou > (viz výše). > > 2) informovat lidi, co sice s použitím svých současných i budoucích příspěvků > pod ODbl souhlasí, ale chtějí zachovat jejich vetší míru > nezávislosti na OSMF, že mohou potvrdit ExtraLicense. > Donutit OSMF, aby bylo slíbeno, že bude tato informace a seznam > souhlasících trvale k dispozici. Zároveň zajistit, aby se alespoň > souhlas s CC-BY-SA u autorů promítl shodným způsobem do databáze > a JOSM jako je zobrazen souhlas s CT. > > 3) s lidmi, kteří ani s těmito podmínkami nebudou souhlasit, > dohodnout vzájemný "obchod". Když se prosazení ODbl nepodaří > zablokovat (dnes již nepravděpodobné), tak je pro vznik větve pod > CC-BY-SA (http://fosm.org/) určitě výhodné, aby mohla přejímat > i budoucí úpravy od co možná největšího množství přispěvatelů > do ODbl OSM databáze. To jim slib ExtraLicenses od přispěvatelů > zajistí. Mohou se tedy dohodnout s přispěvateli OSM, že za určité > množství uživatelů (jejich dat) uvolní jejich stávající data pd ODbl. > > Kdyžtak dejte vědět, kdo by s takovými podmínkami souhlasil. > > Pavle, bylo by pro Tebe přijatelné takovouto dohodu přijmout?
Nejak dohodnout se ochoten jsem, ted uvidime jestli legal@ je ochoten diskutovat. Pavel -- (english) http://www.livejournal.com/~pavelmachek (cesky, pictures) http://atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz/~pavel/picture/horses/blog.html

2.4.2012 10:35:00 (#2)

Pavel Pisa

<ppisa4lists at pikron.com>
Excuse me for yet again resend, but legal list requires subscription and I have not expected to have to deal with it in the past. Some typos corrected and reasons clarified. Hello Pavel, On Saturday 31 March 2012 17:03:28 Pavel Machek wrote: zobrazit citaci
> Ahoj! > > > Zdravím Pavla a ostatní přispěvatele z Čech, > > (Sorry ze mi to tak dlouho trvalo).
thanks for reply, but I think, that affair is already lost and damage caused to community data is inevitable Scheduled service notice: OpenStreetMap database will be in read-only mode from April 1st to April 4th And I agree that you are not that who is to blame. I am in bitter mood today, because the advocate (Erik the Vicking) who contacted me (2011-02-15) with supplicate for new license and terms confirmation, expressed in his reply to my concerns that at least some of them are legitimate and that he would report them to the the OpenStreetMap Foundation board. Nothing has happended since then. I have signed the ODbL (I generally agree with reasons for layers combination, commercial use and accumulation of corrections under ODbL on layer basis) to choose smaller damage when I could not more edit my data under original rems. I am strongly against the way the Contribution Terms has been forced to new contributors. This has been undemocratic way how to over-vote existing contributors. I clicked to allow my work to be used (or even abused) under these terms only to minimize damage with frightened heart for open OSM future. If at least next CT terms changes are not codified, then only good will of people in Cloudmade and other full time and commercial users of data protects OSM again gaining of full dominance of some evil entity with aim to tighten single party lock on the data and abuse of the community. And the way CT has been forced to us shows that this hope for good will is quite weak. There are changes in CT, I have asked for more than year ago. The period of (at least) 3 months should be codified for first suggestion of future license change and initial discussion. Then period for vote should be at least 3 months. (There are people who go for long journeys with GPS or without and who do not have access or do not like to be on-line during they expeditions and their contributions could be extremely valuable for areas which are of my biggest interrest). I agree that data and community have bigger value than infinite rights of single member and that some way to deal with dead people's data and long time inactive members is necessary. But the rules are quite tight when somebody who is not 14-days on-line losing her/his rights even if she/he contributed with great amount of work three years ago. It is quite impolite (and even if she/he is only monitoring work and not contributing last year). Actual terms (paragraph 3) allows to start periodically voting for new license and CT term without any limitations and time guarantee. Terms defining a contributor (three months in year) are favoring people with full time jobs on project and those connected to related commercial activities. So whole volunteers driven OSM project can change to commercial one with paid fees for participation or even into something worse. There are demanded fees for some cloudmade "services". I.e. if you do not to accept third party advertisements in your data on mobile platform. I consider that allowed when they invest to the infrastructure and that particular SW is their company closed source offer but data and community contributed SW has to be under community control and really open licenses. But rules favors paid fulltimers and foundation board to control project more easily and enforce policy to others (which has been shown by way CT has been established) and that is dangerous. I have signed CC-BY-SA in ExtraLicensing to protect usability of my (relatively small) contribution to the work to be usable for alternative (may be even open community future backup) projects. http://timsc.dev.openstreetmap.org/extralicenses/ But this information is not propagated to main OSM database and not seen in JOSM. Compared to CT terms agreement shown and promoted everywhere. I still consider next way to balance profit of both ODbL proponents and people who cannot agree with CT (like Pavel Machek is) or ODbL tied future as the best solution. OSM foundation should offer (by e-mail) to all members possibility to confirm agreement with use of their future contributions even under CC-BY-SA and maintain displaying of CC-BY-SA compatible data marks in main OSM database. This step should help people from alternative non-ODbL project and they could (in return) help ODbL group by allowing their already included data to be used under ODbL. Any way, I consider all this unfortunate and I thing that there is more problem on side of the foundation proponents and Cloudmade commercial entrepreneurs than on the side of volunteer contributors who did not agree with terms change. With hope for constructive and open future, Pavel Pisa e-mail: pisa na cmp.felk.cvut.cz www: http://cmp.felk.cvut.cz/~pisa university: http://dce.fel.cvut.cz/ -- Yours sincerely Pavel Pisa ================================================== PiKRON s.r.o. Phone/Fax: +420 2 84684676 Kankovskeho 1235 Phone: +420 2 84684676 182 00 Praha 8 WWW: http://www.pikron.com/ Czech Republic e-mail: pikron na pikron.com ==================================================

« zpět na výpis měsíce